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[Randall Hyde]

Processing:
Dynamics: 2 x Behringer MDX4600 (ouch - yes I know... but they're only $150!!)

Get the TC Electronics C350 (or whatever the model number is these days). In my younger days I bought MDX4600 units. Regretted it ever since. They sound electronic, are feedback prone, and don't offer a whole lot of control. The best thing I can say about them is that they haven't broken yet -- though that's largely because they haven't been used much (replaced them many years back with C300 units).

For now the kiddies will have to make do with a Mackie as the mixer.  Next go 'round with the budget, I intend to put in for a 24-channel Studiolive

You might consider http://www.softwareaudioconsole.com.
However, it *does* have a complex user interface for a lot of the detailed stuff and this might affect your decision.

[/quote]
Obviously, any comments on the above are welcome, but here's where I REALLY need the help

Amps:
For amps, I am trying to go with either the QSC GX series, the Crest CPX series, or the Yamaha P series. 
Anyone have any comments on these?  The QSC's are the cheapest, so I am leaning most heavily in that direction.
[/quote]
Too bad about the (not) used requirements.
Amps are one area where you can get some great deals on solid gear for used equipment. Not a big fan of buying used speakers (or even mics) because they're too easy to abuse, but amps tend to handle a moderate amount of abuse without too many ill effects.

Here's my biggest connundrum:

I have $700 - $1000 left in the budget.  I still need a crossover, reverb, 24x8 main snake, 8-12 ch sub snake, cabling (mic and speaker), stands, racks, power, soldering irons, multimeters, etc.

I guess I should also take shipping into the equation, so I should leave some slush for that too...

Sorry for the length.  Thanks for your insight.

24x8 snake won't be cheap. If you really need eight returns (e.g., six monitor channels) it might be less expensive to go with two lesser-quality snakes. I bought a 24x8 snake several years back and it was about $2,000 by itself (granted, a bit higher quality). With the money you've got left, I'd look at OSP snakes. I have a 6-channel OSP snake ($79) and it seems to be better built than many of the moderately-priced snakes I've purchased over the years. You might also buy a 24x4 (cheaper because this is the most common 24-channel snake out there) and buy a 4- or 8-channel fantail snake to run in parallel with it.

Ought to have a DBX DriveRack PA+ (or similar) for teaching purposes.

I echo the point that the system you're describing will be difficult to cover 850 people. It *might* get loud enough, but you'll have 0dB headroom left to play with.  OTOH, it's a lot more work to learn how to get a system sounding good when you've got no headroom than it is to learn out to get a system working that has oodles of headroom; Life was a whole lot easier for me when I went from 5,000 watts to 50,000 watts, for example.

monoprice.com can be your friend.
Cheers,
Randy Hyde

[Doug Maye]

Many of you have been kind enough to chime in on my other two threads, and have given me much good advice.  For that I am extremely grateful.  I am hoping to impinge once more on the collective wisdom and experience on this board.

For those not clear on what I am after: I need a "training" system that will have to cover multiple types of situations from a medium-sized blackbox theatre, smaller outdoor concerts (100 people or so), on up to a 850-seat college theater.

By training system, I need to use this gear to teach budding soundies who are currently community college students.  I am going with passive boxes and separate amps and processing rather than powered boxes for the reason of teaching concepts of impedance, power, setting crossovers, etc.

So taking all of that (and a few other things) into consideration, here is what I have compiled

Mains:
2 x Yamaha S115V
Subs:
2 x EV ELX118 or 2 x SW118V
Utility: i.e. Delay stack/Sidefill/Large Wedge/Small Mains:
2 x Yamaha SM12V
Wedges:
4 x Yamaha SM10V

Processing:
Graphics: 3 x DBX 231
Dynamics: 2 x Behringer MDX4600 (ouch - yes I know... but they're only $150!!)

Mic's:
2 x KSM32
4 x beta 58
4 x SM57
1 x DMK 57-52 Drum Mic Kit (1 b52; 3 57's)
8 x Behringer Active DI's (ouch again, but they're only $35!)

For now the kiddies will have to make do with a Mackie as the mixer.  Next go 'round with the budget, I intend to put in for a 24-channel Studiolive

Obviously, any comments on the above are welcome, but here's where I REALLY need the help

Amps:
For amps, I am trying to go with either the QSC GX series, the Crest CPX series, or the Yamaha P series. 
Anyone have any comments on these?  The QSC's are the cheapest, so I am leaning most heavily in that direction.

Here's my biggest connundrum:

I have $700 - $1000 left in the budget.  I still need a crossover, reverb, 24x8 main snake, 8-12 ch sub snake, cabling (mic and speaker), stands, racks, power, soldering irons, multimeters, etc.

I guess I should also take shipping into the equation, so I should leave some slush for that too...

Sorry for the length.  Thanks for your insight.

Whatever speaker processor you decide to go with should have a good brick wall limiter. Students can destroy things in the blink of an eye.

[Jordan Wolf]

Shotguns and/or hanging choir mics, which you also don't have listed, are very common if theater settings to mic choirs, provide area mic'ing of the stage, etc.  Having headset, handheld and distant mic options would be very helpful to show the effects on gain before feedback, phasing and so forth.

I agree with Brad.  It would also be good to look into boundary mics (the ubiquitous Crown PCC-160, or Bruce Bartlett's newer version of it).  They're great for covering areas of the stage and will really help "sound newbies" understand why it's so important for people (and sources, too, I guess) to project.  I find area mic'ing very effective with ensemble numbers and anything with rhythmic dancing (tap, tango, tribal, etc.).

Hanging mics (I always see the Audio-Technica U853a) can help, but I think that they are limited in their usefulness as an actual tool unless you can fly them in close enough (usually, tall set pieces will make this impossible).

If you go for anything wireless, make sure you don't buy cheap.  As with most things in life - and especially with wireless devices - you get what you pay for.  I absolutely guarantee that the flexibility, reliability, and resultant future-proofness of good units will far outweigh the up-front costs associated with them.  Do it right NOW and you will get to enjoy them LATER for years to come.

[Loren Aguey]

I'd also drop the KSM32's - at $549 a pop, they're too nice for this setup. If you want to stay with Shure, their SM27 is $299 and sounds great.  There are other LDC microphones for less.

Drum mics - unless you're getting the Shure package to also have 3 SM57's, the CAD Pro-7 mic kit is liked by several, and  at $150 can put more money back in your pocket.

By switching Betas for SMs, 32s for 27s, and the CAD drum mic, you're saving approx. $989 to put to other things. Given your budget, I think it makes sense. Plus if they're learning, make them learn to make the lower end stuff sound good.

Audiopile can be one stop for snakes, speaker cables, mic cables, racks, etc.; they may be able to combine shipping on items and their service is excellent.

I agree with Ned and Dan who mentioned earlier those condensers are disproportionately nice compared to the rest of your setup. Another + 1 for dropping the beta's as well. I don't consider them worth more $ in any situation let alone your tight budget.

As for the drum mics, I agree the Shure package is not the best option for you I just would not recommend that particular CAD kit. Obviously there's nothing wrong with good ol' Beta 52's and SM 57's. But 57's for toms are a pain, either you need more mic stands (which suck for toms) or you have the massive clip on setup that will more likely than not be in the way.

For a drum mic kit, consider these:

http://www.amazon.com/ELECTROVOICE-PLDK5-Drum-Mic-Pack/dp/B001KX3J2M/ref=sr_1_15?s=musical-instruments&ie=UTF8&qid=1323707569&sr=1-15

http://www.frontendaudio.com/Equation-Audio-MTD-8-3-8-Piece-Drum-Mic-Kit-p/9999-02534.htm

Or this other CAD set:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audio/cad-premium-7-piece-drum-microphone-pack/271264000000000

The problem with the CAD pro-7 set is less with the sound and more with the built on clips on those tom mics. When they break, which they will in a very short period of time, you're left with a mic that has to be taped on to the tom or to a mic stand. My rule of thumb is never buy cheap mics with built in clips.

Also if you choose the equation set or the higher level CAD set you have condensers that come with it. Saves you well over a grand right there. For any drum mic set I also recommend these clips.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/accessories/km-microphone-holder-for-drums

They don't break, and they hold a very stong grip and fit on almost all kits. 

Good luck.

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