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Author Topic: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)  (Read 15785 times)

Rob Gow

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Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« on: December 06, 2010, 10:50:36 am »

I have a curious audio problem, that only happens when I use my snake. This has to do with my subs, which are XLR fed.

When I'm not using my snake, everything is fine. I have TRS outputs on my Yorkville Unity processor. So I have a TRS to XLR adapter cable. No problems, everything is fine.

When I use my snake, it has a TRS male, at the fantail, and TRS female on the box (obviously) so I use the TRS to XLR at the box, and then XLR to the sub. Everything is fine, but it just won't reach to my rack from the fantail, so I use a TRS extender (male to female)

Everything checks out fine, until I use the extender.

The  TRS to XLR checks out fine:

Tip = pin 2
Ring = pin 3
sleeve = pin 1

With the TRS to XLR plugged into the box, it checks out fine as well, from fantail to the end of the adapter cord.

Again:


Tip = pin 2
Ring = pin 3
sleeve = pin 1

But when I add the TRS male to female extender to the fantail and check, this is what happens:


Tip = pin 2 & pin 3
Ring = dead on pin 2 & 3
sleeve = pin 1

If I test the extender on its own with a TRS to TRS patch cable, it's fine:

T = T
R = R
S = S

If I test the extender with the TRS -> XLR it checks out as well:


Tip = pin 2
Ring = pin 3
sleeve = pin 1

It's just the combination of all 3 that gives me the problem. My workaround is to not push the TRS to XLR in all the way, at the box. I know that's not right, but it works.


Any ideas?

Again, everything on their own checks out. With the snake, I plug a short TRS patch cable into the box, and testing from the fantail,

T = T, R = R, and S = S.

It has always done this from the start, with that combination. Of all 3 cords, has nothing to do with the sub or Unity processor, as the testing is just with the wiring alone. (final XLR cord from the TRS to XLR to the sub has no effect, so it's been left out of the testing chain)



Any ideas? Testing signal with a multimeter.
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Geoff Doane

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2010, 11:13:37 am »

Rob Gow wrote on Mon, 06 December 2010 11:50


Tip = pin 2 & pin 3
Ring = dead on pin 2 & 3
sleeve = pin 1




Maybe there's something funny with the different connectors and they don't mate quite the way they should.  With signal on both pins 2 and 3 at the sub, the CMRR of the input will cancel out any signal that is there.  Pulling the plug part way out unbalances the signal, but now the input XLR just sees one signal, and it works.

I know it doesn't answer the question, but my solution would be to change the TRS connections on the snake to XLR, and use an extra long TRS>XLR adapter at the rack to reach the snake return.

GTD
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Alfredo Cannon

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2010, 11:19:34 am »

If your snake is balanced cable (which it should be) just make sure your trs/xlr cable you plug into the box is also balanced cable. This is not your problem, though. Just making sure you know you should be using balanced instead of unbalanced.
 Now. What I would do is use xlr mic cable as extension cable. They connect to eachother to make one long cable. You can try that or just wait for a pro to answer your question. I'm an amateur sound guy.
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Jeff Wheeler

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2010, 11:28:37 am »

Get an extender that mates better with your other connectors?
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Christian Tepfer

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2010, 12:32:01 pm »

In addition to what's already said, why do you use a TRS extender anyway? Since you do to XLR you could extend that with the better connector system.

Mac Kerr

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2010, 02:21:04 pm »

Christian Tepfer wrote on Mon, 06 December 2010 12:32

In addition to what's already said, why do you use a TRS extender anyway? Since you do to XLR you could extend that with the better connector system.


My thoughts exactly. Why are you using TRS to extend instead of XLR?

Mac
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Rob Spence

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2010, 02:31:30 pm »

Perhaps your "TRS Extender" is really a headphone extension cord.

Extend it with XLRs.
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Ryan Lantzy

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2010, 04:04:02 pm »

Mac Kerr wrote on Mon, 06 December 2010 14:21

Christian Tepfer wrote on Mon, 06 December 2010 12:32

In addition to what's already said, why do you use a TRS extender anyway? Since you do to XLR you could extend that with the better connector system.


My thoughts exactly. Why are you using TRS to extend instead of XLR?

Mac


Because he has TRS male at the fantail (mixer end) and TRS female at the stage box end.  He stated his fantail did not reach to his rack so he used a TRS female to TRS male extender from the fantail to the rack.

I think he just has a bum TRS female to male patch cable and should consider changing the ends on his fantail to XLR OR building a quality TRS female to male cable with Neutrik or Switchcraft TRS connectors.
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Jordan Wolf

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2010, 04:14:55 pm »

Ryan Lantzy wrote on Mon, 06 December 2010 16:04


I think he...should consider changing the ends on his fantail to XLR...


The OP should just change over to XLR and be done with it.
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Duane Massey

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Re: Curious audio puzzle (TRS -> XLR)
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2010, 10:24:41 pm »

+1 on changing to XLR; Examine the TRS connectors closely. There are some out there that are not standard, but you have to look really close to see the difference.
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Duane Massey
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