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[Bob Leonard]

Tony "T" Tissot wrote on Wed, 05 May 2010 23:38

I'm quite familiar, having worked for an optical networking company that operated what is euphemistically referred to as "employee housing". I know every reason for them and every defense of them. I am intimately familiar with the accepted labor practices, particularly in the Pearl River delta, for the high-tech industries. I do know about our own domestic textile - and later mining - industry practices. There are reasons why "company towns" are no longer tolerated here. My original observation stands. No matter how a video shines it.

Tony,
You are certainly correct. In this area, New England, anyone living in the area who knows some history can tell you that housing your employees was nothing more than another form of control and another form of income for the company.

[John Roberts {JR}]

Bob Leonard wrote on Thu, 06 May 2010 07:09

Tony "T" Tissot wrote on Wed, 05 May 2010 23:38 I'm quite familiar, having worked for an optical networking company that operated what is euphemistically referred to as "employee housing". I know every reason for them and every defense of them. I am intimately familiar with the accepted labor practices, particularly in the Pearl River delta, for the high-tech industries. I do know about our own domestic textile - and later mining - industry practices. There are reasons why "company towns" are no longer tolerated here. My original observation stands. No matter how a video shines it. Tony, You are certainly correct. In this area, New England, anyone living in the area who knows some history can tell you that housing your employees was nothing more than another form of control and another form of income for the company.

At the risk of sounding remotely like I am defending the practice, and the dormitory system is clearly tilted in favor of the manufacturers. These manufacturing regions attract very poor workers from pretty far away who would probably be living in much worse conditions until their first paycheck or two. Since they often work just to save and/or send money home, they would seek out similar low cost shelter if that wasn't available.  

The vast majority of these factory-dormitory complexes don't rise to the scale of a factory town with only one dominant manufacturer in a given area. OTOH Behringer city seems intentionally sited away from other manufacturers. I will not go so far as to suggest it replicates the worst of the factory town system we have seen before in our history, but I will argue that all manufacturer supplied housing isn't remotely altruistic.  

JR

[Bob Leonard]

John Roberts  {JR} wrote on Thu, 06 May 2010 10:20

Bob Leonard wrote on Thu, 06 May 2010 07:09 Tony "T" Tissot wrote on Wed, 05 May 2010 23:38 I'm quite familiar, having worked for an optical networking company that operated what is euphemistically referred to as "employee housing". I know every reason for them and every defense of them. I am intimately familiar with the accepted labor practices, particularly in the Pearl River delta, for the high-tech industries. I do know about our own domestic textile - and later mining - industry practices. There are reasons why "company towns" are no longer tolerated here. My original observation stands. No matter how a video shines it. Tony, You are certainly correct. In this area, New England, anyone living in the area who knows some history can tell you that housing your employees was nothing more than another form of control and another form of income for the company. At the risk of sounding remotely like I am defending the practice, and the dormitory system is clearly tilted in favor of the manufacturers. These manufacturing regions attract very poor workers from pretty far away who would probably be living in much worse conditions until their first paycheck or two. Since they often work just to save and/or send money home, they would seek out similar low cost shelter if that wasn't available.   The vast majority of these factory-dormitory complexes don't rise to the scale of a factory town with only one dominant manufacturer in a given area. OTOH Behringer city seems intentionally sited away from other manufacturers. I will not go so far as to suggest it replicates the worst of the factory town system we have seen before in our history, but I will argue that all manufacturer supplied housing isn't remotely altruistic.   JR

JR,
Well you caught my drift. Having spent a good amount of time in in the far east, and growing up and living in New England with mills very close to my own home it's easy to compare. The type of dormitory housing I see with MOST asian companies replicates my worst military experiences. Living quarters void of all but the most needed creature features and a place to stay while saving some money.

On the flip side none of this is free and in most cases the costs associated with this type of living can and will often prove to be a much higher expense than if quarters were available away from the plant, mill or factory. In most of asia the majority of the people working at these jobs are poorly educated women who have been sent by their families to work and send money home. They have no transportation or for the most part long term goals other than sending that money home. Living in company housing allows them to do just that, however it's a catch 22. Rent and food are paid for with the wages they earn, money which in turn goes back to the employer. And let's not paint this picture with 5 stars. These are small rooms with 6-8-10 people per room in most cases.

The mill housing of New England was very similar to this in the 1800's, and once again the majority of the workers female.

On the other hand, Japan has embraced this practice of corporate unity. Corporate housing, predominantly for single men and women, is spacious by Japans standards, clean and provided free of charge to those who demonstrate the need. The Japanese worker also spends more time at the job, up to 4 hours more per day than an American worker. However, that time is spent building pride in the company and amoung themselves, something lost to American industry today. Lunch breaks often last longer than 2 hours, breaks are for relaxing, and even vacations are taken at company owned resorts, theme parks and cottages free of charge.

I'm not fooled by Behringers video at all. I've spent too much time in that part of the world.

[Mark Walter]

Well, this thread was a half hour of my life I'll never get back....

[John Roberts {JR}]

This is pretty old debate here.. and in general our trade with these poor regions has raised their quality of life in these poor nations.

The company town system is ripe for abuse but not abusive in nature. It all depends on how it is operated, and if the workers have other options. The appropriate question is how much living space do workers want? The japanese have also set the example for minimalistic personal space with their, overnight hotels(?) that are barely larger than one person, who crawls up into a sleeping bunk carved into the wall. Given free choice where space is dear, they choose tiny, at least for sleeping off their drunk.  

I suspect they want ice water in hell and luxurious apartments for workers, but the practical reality is they can't or won't pay for more than dormitories with shared living spaces. We need to try to look at this from their perspective. Longer term workers who have saved a few won, probably find housing off campus. Most short term workers are not there for a career but to save money, so for them the cheapest living space they can find, means they save faster, and can return home to the countryside sooner with a bankroll, or move on to a higher paying job in the city after they gain some experience.  

As much as i would like to, I won't accuse Behringer of abusing the dormitory system without proof. By locating away from other factories in a relatively isolated region, his workers are less likely to job hop to a nearby factory, giving him a little more leverage regarding pay.    

JR

PS: I never shared a room with more than 40 or so troops in the Army.  

[Jack Wooten]

So very true....Ive learned one thing here...all these ppl have their own opinion.....Me i say if it works and makes noise use it......

[Royce Covington]

Mark Walter wrote on Fri, 07 May 2010 05:44

Well, this thread was a half hour of my life I'll never get back....

just as it was in march of last year...